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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
I suspect that as the granny charger is likely to be on the floor IP67 is appropriate, whereas a wall charger which under normal circumstances isn't likely to get submerged the showerproof IP54 rating is acceptable. There's no evidence to say that the rating for the BP charger is a problem.
 

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There's no evidence to say that the rating for the BP charger is a problem.
There is also no evidence that I'll ever get it to find out. Mine was included in the purchase price nearly 6 months ago and BP and the dealer (Inchcape Norwich) and BP's subcontractor and the DNO (area board) are still arguing over a 5 minute job of changing the main incoming fuse from a 60A one to an 80A one.....
Maybe the fuse isn't IP rated .... the fuse and meter are in an external wall box, but my electricity supplier had no problems installing a smart meter (it was them that said I really ought to have an 80A fuse for an EV, but they weren't allowed to change it, Only the DNO can do that, maybe next millennium)
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
There is also no evidence that I'll ever get it to find out. Mine was included in the purchase price nearly 6 months ago and BP and the dealer (Inchcape Norwich) and BP's subcontractor and the DNO (area board) are still arguing over a 5 minute job of changing the main incoming fuse from a 60A one to an 80A one.....
Maybe the fuse isn't IP rated .... the fuse and meter are in an external wall box, but my electricity supplier had no problems installing a smart meter (it was them that said I really ought to have an 80A fuse for an EV, but they weren't allowed to change it, Only the DNO can do that, maybe next millennium)
I must agree it is pretty poor that you're still waiting and hopefully not typical. When my Podpoint was fitted they (Podpoint) downgraded the output to 5kW as my fuse is also 60A (typical for 70s properties). Although the DNO initially indicated that they would change it to 80A in the end they agreed to the output being changed to 7kW. I guess they must have their reasons but some electric showers are over 7kW and I'm not aware that you have to specifically notify the DNO to fit one, unlike an EV supply.
 

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Yes, it's a mess.

A 60A fuse is more than enough for a 7kW (32A) charger

Just like it is for an electric shower.

As you say, 60A is typical for a 70's property, mine is '73...

The electrician who came and installed the 100A isolator said the incoming cable was good for 100A (or he would have refused to put the !00A switch in) but only the DNO could change the main incoming fuse to an 80A one if that was what BP wanted.

So I have the new 100A isolator but no-one will do anything else unless the DNO changes the fuse....

And I have put up with BoJo the clown and his comedy troupe of scientific advisors telling us we should all go "green"
 

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Not so good, however, if someone wants a shower whilst you are charging?
But we don't have an electric shower (oil fired central heating and hot water in rural Suffolk) and, although I work a lot on-line overnight, I don't remember ever taking a shower between 00:30 and 04:30 even if it was electric.

I can't ever remember Anna having a shower between 00:30 and 04:30 either but I do sleep quite well so I may have missed it, the phantom midnight shower taker, unheard and un-noticed. It wouldn't even show on my electricity bill as the hot water is oil and the shower pump is only about 360W.
 

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Our electric shower is 9.5kw. No notification to any one by me but think the electrician did register its install. Will remember not to shower and charge simultaneouly🤣
 

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I think the whole point is that most of us charge on a cheap overnight tariff, and a 7kW charger is just under 32A, same as a standard ring main, and the ring main is mostly daytime use.

A 7kW charger is not going to challenge a normal DNO 60A fuse.

If I start putting timers on things like washing machine, tumble drier, dishwasher to use the cheap rate too it might get close to 60A but I'd have to go out to my garage in the early hours of the morning and start doing some seriously big welding job with my large MIG to exceed 60A.
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
Sorry I’ve lead this slightly off topic from the cable bag with the shower comparison!!

It is as Rod has described a comparative normal domestic load and my point was that you are typically not having to gain permission to fit or upgrade one, whereas with an EV charge point you do need to advise the DNO. Anyone with an older property will typically needs a fuse upgrade from 60A to protect their supply from potential unwanted outages.

Back to topic, I ordered another bag this week so when it arrives I’ll add some pictures with my leads in case it may be of use to anyone.
 

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If you were delivered a car without a boot floor I can see why you might want a bag, but if you have a solid boot floor above it, does it really need to be in a bag ?
I don't have my SE yet, but if it doesn't come with bags I will be purchasing them as when i've test driven the SE the cables loose pretty much use up the whole under floor space, and coming from having an F56 with the floor space i'm used to having and using that space.

The "granny" charger is marked IP67 !!!

That means I can submerge it 1 metre of water.

If the BP charger - if I ever get it - is only IP54, it isn't really fit for purpose on an outside wall...
IP67 means it can withstand immersion in water up to 1m deep for up to 30 mins, my Samsung phone is IP68 and isn't waterproof. If your granny charger is left outside 24/7 in a location that gets full exposure to the rain it could get water ingress over time. It isn't waterproof, it's very water resistant.

It's not unusual for a chargepoint to be rated at IP54 - i've ordered the Easee One which is also IP54 and designed to withstand the Norwegian Winter. For something which will be outside permanently and having constant exposure to weather it's not about making it "waterproof" because that would be impossible, it's about letting the water get in and get out without touching the electrical components, hence IP54 is suitable.

Our electric shower is 9.5kw. No notification to any one by me but think the electrician did register its install. Will remember not to shower and charge simultaneouly🤣
The reason for all the checks etc for chargepoints is because although your shower could pull 32AMPS it won't be running continuously at that level for several hours, same with an electric oven (usually the 2nd largest draw), even if it's on for 3 hours, once it's at temperature it will use less power to maintain that heat. With a chargepoint your car could be pulling 32AMPS for 4 hours solid, if you have a car with a bigger battery than the mini that could be 6/8/10 hours. Electricity installations are ok at handling short pulls of higher amounts that they should, what they don't cope well with is prolonged high loading.

With the comments about only charging at night when the current draw from your house is low you are completely right, but electrical installations are not setup around what will be plugged in, but what "could" be plugged in. For a future to work with EVs in every house it needs to be fine to have your car charging while someone is having a shower while the oven is warming up and the kettle is boiling and someone else is using a hairdryer. In fact a thought I just had about the mini is what about pre-conditioning, I don't know what current that draws, but although I will charge overnight, I might be pre-conditioning while someone is in the shower and the kettle is on.
 

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OK, so two topics here now!

1 - the bag; I didn't get one but equally if I did I doubt I'd use it. Coiling and stowing the cable is already a bit of a faff, getting it into a bag as well...? When wet too...? No thanks, the under-floor area is perfect for the unbagged cables. And to the point about never using the type 2 cable - many public chargers are untethered so at some point I predict you'll need it.

2 - fuses and loads and whatnot; my PodPoint installation includes a current sensor on the house main cable, which will turn the charger down if it detects a high load on the house. Also, I made sure to avoid BP Pulse, despite some very compelling reasons to have it. One look at customer feedback is enough to find a better solution (and I can't fault PodPoint).
 

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No, it's an interesting topic in it's own right (even if it should have been separate from the cable bag question).

My purchase - nearly six months ago - included a BP 7kW charger.

They sent around the first sub-contractor to install a 100A isolator switch between the meter and consumer unit.
I'm an engineer myself although my degree is mechanical rather than electrical but we had a long chat whilst he was doing it about the existing cable sizes and and main incoming fuse.

There is a golden rule with electricity that fuses are not there to protect the appliance but to protect the cable(s) after the fuse and before the appliance.

I'm not sure BP (or their subcontractor) understand this but maybe the second sub-contractor who came around to survey the cable route did understand it and that's why I still have the standard 60A fuse and the DNO won't change it.
 

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Rod's charger installation challenges have cropped up in several threads about other things. I would suggest that he starts a new thread regarding the issue so we can try and help sort out the problem without distraction.

Alan
 

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" For a future to work with EVs in every house it needs to be fine to have your car charging while someone is having a shower while the oven is warming up and the kettle is boiling and someone else is using a hairdryer"

Absolutely true....

But try living in a village in rural Suffolk....

Our electricity supply is marginal at best, power cuts are regular at peak times, no gas so all cooking is electric although most heating and hot water is oil or coal.

I'm the only EV owner so far, 90% of the village ask why I have a funny green stripe on my number plates...

Because I only need to charge overnight (octopus 5p rate) I don't really threaten the supply but what if the other 300 residents (according to the last census) also bought EVs ?

BoJo the clown and his comedy troupe of scientific advisors really haven't tgought this through.

EDIT - sorry, posted before I saw the comment above.
 

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Discussion Starter · #35 ·
Rod's charger installation challenges have cropped up in several threads about other things. I would suggest that he starts a new thread regarding the issue so we can try and help sort out the problem without distraction.

Alan
Alan, I think you raise a good point that maybe JB can help with. Since there are now more SE users and others looking at the SE is it possible to subdivide some of the topics in a similar way to the main forum? Such as Charging, mods improvements, range, useful info.

If it’s not, it’s not, just a suggestion.
 

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The problem with the low rate overnight electricity is that if you have a granny charger it’s nowhere near long enough to put a decent charge in. At least with a 7kW charger you stand a chance of filling it up within the prescribed hours.
 

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Since there are now more SE users and others looking at the SE is it possible to subdivide some of the topics in a similar way to the main forum? Such as Charging, mods improvements, range, useful info.
In principle that's a good idea although for the number of SE owners currently active on the forum the work involved may not be warranted. One for the future perhaps. Rod has charger installation issues which are specific to him and I still think it would be a good idea if he simply created a new thread.

Alan
 

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Rod has charger installation issues which are specific to him and I still think it would be a good idea if he simply created a new thread.
Fair point but what would I say ? But I'll give it a go....
 

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Sorry I’ve lead this slightly off topic from the cable bag with the shower comparison!!

It is as Rod has described a comparative normal domestic load and my point was that you are typically not having to gain permission to fit or upgrade one, whereas with an EV charge point you do need to advise the DNO. Anyone with an older property will typically needs a fuse upgrade from 60A to protect their supply from potential unwanted outages.

Back to topic, I ordered another bag this week so when it arrives I’ll add some pictures with my leads in case it may be of use to anyone.
Do you have a part number handy for the bag? @Stuts11 (forgive me if I missed it already)
 

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Discussion Starter · #40 ·
Do you have a part number handy for the bag? @Stuts11 (forgive me if I missed it already)
I haven’t been able to find a part number for the genuine mini bag. I should get the one above on Friday so I”ll add a review with some pictures over the weekend. At £10.99 it doesn’t seem to bad.
 
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